{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/iiif/db7vm43j94/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["Spoleto: Oral history with Carolyn Kostopoulos"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/212/original/LOHI_aviarybanner2.jpg?1741032082","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Date"]},"value":{"en":["2009-06-05"]}},{"label":{"en":["Interviewer"]},"value":{"en":["Lancia, Jessica"]}},{"label":{"en":["Interviewee"]},"value":{"en":["Kostopoulos, Carolyn"]}},{"label":{"en":["Description"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eCarolyn Kostopoulos, owner of Carelli Costumes, Inc. in New York, has been the wardrobe director of Spoleto Festival U.S.A. since 1982. Kostopoulos discusses her costume work for the festival over the years, the process of designing and creating, and the difference between her work on Broadway and Spoleto. She discusses her relationships with the artists who wear her designs and details the various costume headquarters she has had in Charleston including the haunted old city jail. Audio with transcript.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["LCDL Collection"]},"value":{"en":["Spoleto Festival USA Oral History Collection"]}},{"label":{"en":["Contributing Institution"]},"value":{"en":["College of Charleston Libraries"]}},{"label":{"en":["Media Type"]},"value":{"en":["Oral Histories"]}},{"label":{"en":["Subject - Personal or Corporate"]},"value":{"en":["Spoleto Festival U.S.A."]}},{"label":{"en":["Subject - Topical"]},"value":{"en":["Festivals","Theater--Production and direction","Opera--Production and direction","Costume designers","Costume design"]}},{"label":{"en":["Subject - Geographic"]},"value":{"en":["Charleston (S.C.)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Subject - Geographic County"]},"value":{"en":["Charleston County (S.C.)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Language"]},"value":{"en":["English"]}},{"label":{"en":["Date Digital"]},"value":{"en":["2009-11-25"]}},{"label":{"en":["Digitization Specifications"]},"value":{"en":["Mp3 derivative audio created with Audacity software.  Archival masters are wav files."]}},{"label":{"en":["Type IMT"]},"value":{"en":["application/pdf","audio/mpeg"]}},{"label":{"en":["Rights Statement"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eCopyright 2009, Spoleto Festival USA. All rights reserved. For more information contact Special Collections, College of Charleston Libraries, Charleston, SC 29424.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["PID"]},"value":{"en":["lcdl:27151"]}},{"label":{"en":["Collection Identifier"]},"value":{"en":["COH"]}}],"summary":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eCarolyn Kostopoulos, owner of Carelli Costumes, Inc. in New York, has been the wardrobe director of Spoleto Festival U.S.A. since 1982. Kostopoulos discusses her costume work for the festival over the years, the process of designing and creating, and the difference between her work on Broadway and Spoleto. She discusses her relationships with the artists who wear her designs and details the various costume headquarters she has had in Charleston including the haunted old city jail. Audio with transcript.\u003c/p\u003e"]},"requiredStatement":{"label":{"en":["Attribution"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eCopyright 2009, Spoleto Festival USA. All rights reserved. For more information contact Special Collections, College of Charleston Libraries, Charleston, SC 29424.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},"provider":[{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["Lowcountry Digital Library"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["Lowcountry Digital Library"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/212/original/LOHI_aviarybanner2.jpg?1741032082","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/125/185/small/data?1692817605","type":"Image","format":"image/png"}],"items":[{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 1 - open-uri20211027-32251-1jmmcdh.mpga"]},"duration":4878.888,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/125/185/small/data?1692817605","type":"Image","format":"image/png"}],"items":[{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://aviary-p-cofc.s3.wasabisys.com/collection_resource_files/resource_files/000/125/185/original/open-uri20211027-32251-1jmmcdh.mpga?1635342721","type":"Audio","format":"audio/mpeg","duration":4878.888,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["Interview with Carolyn Kostolpoulos [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay. My name is Jessica Lancia. I am here with Carolyn Kostopoulos. It is June 5th, 2009, and we are at the Gaillard Auditorium in Charleston, South Carolina. So the first thing, Ms. Kostopoulos, is sort of, if you would give me a background of your history with the Spoleto Festival, how you got started.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=0.03,23.863"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e I think it was 1980, and I had a job in New York that I didn't like very much. And I wanted him to lay me off so I could collect unemployment, and he, my boss, wouldn't do that because he really liked me. And so one of my coworkers talked about this thing called the Spoleto Festival that she was applying for, because her husband was applying for a job in the prop department, and she was applying for a job in the wardrobe department. And it was six weeks out of town, and then they would lay me off. And so if I figured if I got this job, they would lay me off, and then I could collect unemployment. And as it turned out, I knew the wardrobe supervisor. And so when I called him up, he said, no, I don't need to see your resume. I've worked with you. If the job is available, it's yours. He had one position open, and he was holding it for somebody. But their boss wouldn't let them go. So, I got the job. Got to collect unemployment after six weeks. That was the whole purpose of.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=28.36,109.56"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e That is why I wanted this job, really. I mean, it sounds ridiculous. When I flew down here, and when he, in fact, when he told me that I got the job, when he called me to tell me I got the job, I'm such a creature of habit. The first thing I thought was, oh, I won't be able to watch the odd couple reruns anymore, really. And he said, you don't sound very excited. And I. I said, well, I'm at work, you know, I can't really jump up and down, but, you know, while I'm at, my boss is here, you know, and he said, oh, I understand, but really what I was thinking was, oh, I have to break my routine now and go to some other place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=111.3,154.37"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e And then when I, when I got here, like the Saturday I came down, the plane landed, And I thought, oh my god, I've found my spiritual center. I, this was in the old days when you had cameras with film, I took 11 rolls of film, I climbed onto people's porches, walked into people's houses, I mean people found me in their yards and taking pictures of doorknobs and fan lights and stuff and said, what are you doing? And I said, I'm in love with your doorknob, I had to get a picture of it and they were like, oh, will you want to see the house? and I thought... Wow, if this was New York, somebody would have pulled out a gun. I'd be in jail right now, but instead I'm having tea with this perfect stranger who's showing me their fan lights and letting me take pictures of them, and like I thought, my father was an architectural draftsman, so I, like, space is so important to me, and I thought this town, this is the best town in the world. Really, I just couldn't imagine. and And so I did the festival, and when we left, all I could think about for a year was coming back.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=155.73,230.96"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e And when the next year, when I came back, I absolutely remember when the plane started to descend on a molecular cellular level. Like every piece of protoplasm in my body just went. Okay, we're home now, you know, totally non-verbal, just like I felt my body come to whatever, stasis or peace. I just felt, yes, I belong here, and we've waited, all of us, all ourselves, have waited all year to be back here, home, whatever that means. It's silly, because I live in New York, but I always tell people that this is fine, that my heart lives here. And on a certain level, it doesn't even have much to do with the festival. The festival is a vehicle to get me to be here every year, you know, until I someday have the guts, or I'm old enough, or whatever, to just bite the bullet and say, okay, I'm moving here, or whatever, but I...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=231.66,301.16"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e But you own the property here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=304.429,305.05"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Four houses, yes, that I bought. Oh, they tipped you off. [laughs] Yes, over a period of time, I have bought four houses here and would buy more. I would buy every house in Charleston, but that's not happening. I think four is fine. Might be mine. I think I hit my limit, But I really, I mean, absolutely the first year I did. Whatever it took in terms of, you know, to see the festival, like if I, if it meant getting up at six in the morning to do the laundry and the ironing and stuff for a particular opera so that I could skedaddle to a chamber music concert at 11, you know, to see the 14 -year -old Joshua Bell play on it, you know, I would do it. I would just, you know, people were, you know, I don't know. sleeping late or trying to go to the beach in their spare time. And I was like, no, I'm like any moment I had to go into a church to get into a building to see a concert or an event. I was there. I just, you know, if I had to stay up all night to get my work done so that I could be free during the day to do that stuff that was available to me. I did that stuff, you know, and I find it so even to this day so sort of thrilling and amazing that, you know, you can just go, you can get on your bike and just bike over and see some world -class event in, you know, shorts and flip -flops and kind of put your feet up, really, and not that it's so un-formal, you know. Now in New York I get irritated when people go to the Met dress less than you know, spectacularly, I think. But they have no respect for the arts or something. But here I just find that. The whole town is art. And so. There's not that distinction and you just think that you're breathing in art. It's all beautiful, it's all... So you don't really have to dress up for it because it's just there it is, it's out there on the streets for you and I find that so lovely.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=305.959,455.49"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e So you came and the title was Wardrobe Mistress?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=459.301,463.0"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e For the first two years, I was just on the Wardrobe staff and then...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=464.69,468.39"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e This was '79, according to Nigel.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=468.04,470.8"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, see, I think it was '80. I don't, I could only tell you by the operas we did.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=472.01,478.93"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Which one was your first opera?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=479.863,480.69"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I did, I dressed Transformations and Chip and his Dog.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=481.41,487.79"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e That was 1980.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=488.38,489.04"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, so that's my first.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=490.69,492.77"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e The first opera, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=493.19,494.63"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e And we were also doing Sonnambula in the Gaillard, but I didn't.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=495.33,501.53"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Sonnambula, Chip and His Dog...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=501.12,501.319"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e That was all the same year, right? And I didn't dress Sonnambula, although I made a costume for it, which is still hanging in the cage, with fabric that I bought at, you know, Anson Fabrics, which is now a condominium on Anson Street.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=502.82,519.2"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e So, just because I don't have the background in costume.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=523.169,525.23"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e What do I do?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=526.39,527.09"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e What do you do for the operas, but also for the different other performances, theater performances?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=527.43,533.85"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, we do various. In New York, I own a costume shop where we make costumes for Broadway, opera, whatever. And what we don't do is get the socks and the stockings and the shoes and the pit pads and all that, the stuff that maintains it. We just make what we see in the picture. It's odd because every year in every opera requires different things. Again, the early days of the festival, or my early days, I'd say, of the festival, which were pretty much the early days. The two festivals were aligned, the Italian festival. And so what would happen is in, I guess, July, they would do an opera or two in Italy. And then when they were done with it, it would go into some container ship and it would make its way to New York, really. And maybe by February, I would have... these clothes that I could, in my shop, and this is an aside, I actually started my business in New York so that I could keep doing the festival. It was an off, that's, see that's how it, I'm gonna go back and say that I took this job to get on unemployment, but what it really did is change the entire course of my because after I met... I met someone down here who made costumes for Transformations who I decided I wanted to work with in New York and started a business so that, and took over as the wardrobe supervisor so that I would have a facility to work on the festival. I wouldn't have a boss who wouldn't let me, you know, not go because I'd be the boss. I would just close or, or, you know, whatever.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=535.26,668.78"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Anyway, so now I have, so I have this costume shop and these clothes would come to me in like February from Italy and they would have been worn by the Westminster Choir College the year before, but like maybe 25 percent of the Westminster Choir College would have then graduated. So some of them would be new, but you know half to three quarters of them would have been still I would be able to look in the Italian clothes and say, oh, that's Mr. So -and -so and that's Ms. So -and -so and so, and they're coming back. And maybe some of the principles would be the same, but maybe some of the principles would be different. So I would have to close in enough time to, let's say, look at the remaining Westminster choir that wasn't coming back. Look at the new people and think, well, you know, she's about her size, he's about his size. These people will fit into these clothes. and these five people. I got nothing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=670.07,727.4"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e So I'm going to send my shopper out, we're going to swatch fabric, I'm going to do some little drawings because I'm not going to copy, I'm not going to absolutely copy the dresses that I can't use, I'm going to make some variation on the themes so that if I could possibly use them all I wouldn't have duplicates, right? And so my shop in New York would then make what we needed to fit in. And then I'd have other duties like, that my normal things that I don't have at my own shop, like I said, we don't do shoes and jewelry and we sometimes do, but, you know, I would have to get all that stuff because invariably that wouldn't come with the production. That would have been rented in Italy. So I would have to figure out what kind of shoes, style, period, color, you know, were appropriate for these clothes. and buy, find, rent, somehow procure, you know, the shoes, the underwear, the jewelry, the hats, whatever didn't come, right? And then all of it would get packed and go down to Charleston, and then down here, we'd have approved that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=729.64,802.84"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e We'd fit things on the principles in the chorus. When the chorus arrived, we'd do whatever alterations and labeling and we'd organize the show. We'd have little accessory bags where we'd put the stockings and the gloves and the pocket watches and the rings, whatever, all the little bits that went with their clothes. And then we'd move it, at a certain point, we'd move the clothes into the theater. and put them in the dressing rooms and we'd set up for dress rehearsals and then we would become the wardrobe crew. We would hook, hook and zip and do quick changes and and take things to the dry cleaner and wash the stockings and polish the shoes and you know fluff the feathers and the hats and steam the dresses and and make sure that nothing got lost and you know hopefully and replace the buttons and and whatever else. And then there are all the other things that come down, like the ballet, the dance companies, and the plays. It's the things that have their own clothes already. But they still need somebody backstage to, you know, to police the dressing room, to do all that, the same, the wardrobe aspect of it versus the costume aspect of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=806.86,885.87"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Then I actually preferred it that way, and the whole festival is geared to do it that way with the clothes coming from Italy. It doesn't work as well when they don't, and of course for the last god knows how many years. Just because there's not that much lead time. I mean, no matter when you get designs, until you put things on bodies, you really can't make anything. And so, you see the chorus comes in so late. By the time the chorus gets here, the director wants them on stage. The music director wants them in music rehearsals. I want them all day for fittings. And then... you know, a week after they arrive, the clothes are somehow supposed to be in the theater ready for, you know. So it's really, it becomes really difficult because I can fit the chorus for three solid days and I'm, I mean, like from, you know, nine in the morning till eight or nine at night, I can just be doing nothing but fitting the chorus. doing nothing. Me and helpers, you know, back -to -back, and then you have to do all, you know, when you come out of three days of fittings with maybe a hundred costumes, even if they all fit perfectly and they just needed name labels sewn in them, but they don't fit perfectly, they need hems, they need to be, you know, and so somebody has to mark all that stuff out for the crew, and then you have to do it. And so it can get really... hysterical. You know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=886.89,988.61"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e I've sometimes I've just sometimes I've had to at the end of fittings like sort of think okay what can we realistically do and what is going into a FedEx box and am I sending it to my shop in New York and saying you have to help me or you have to and if they're too busy you have to find somebody else to help me. You know, because it's bringing in, there's not, like, a lot of local labor here that I can... I've tried that unsuccessfully or my standards are too high or whatever. So I try to set it up so that we don't have to make anything here from scratch, so that everything is made somewhere else. Hopefully, I mean I say hopefully at my shop, which sounds like a conflict of interest, but it's that I have the most control. I know what my product is and I know I know what I want and I know, you know, when it comes from somewhere else sometimes I get these odd little surprises that things aren't so good.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=989.39,1060.79"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e How many of the productions can you do at your shop? Remember all of them? Do you handle the garments for Spoleto every year?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1062.97,1067.769"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, but it also depends on where, I mean, the designer, the two things are gonna dictate where the clothes are made. And one of them is where the designer's preference. And the other one is the budget. If they don't have the money for us to do it, we're not gonna do it. It doesn't matter what I prefer. And if the designer, the designer might live in a foreign country and want the things made, again, so that they have control, They might want things made. at their favorite shop in wherever, you know, France, Italy, something. And so then, yes, we'll just get them and it'll be whatever. The first time I see them is the first time, you know, sometimes my crew, they're like, well, what can you tell us? What can you tell us? And I'm like, guys, the day I open the box, I'm not going to have any prior information than you do. I mean, we just have to be flexible. Yeah, we have to, like... When we open the box, that's when we get the information, that's when we figure out. what it is and what we need to do with it, the box of clothes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1071.14,1141.59"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e That they send you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1142.45,1142.878"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, whatever. They're the crates, whatever they are, you know, the ten boxes of clothes, whatever they are. It'll be a surprise to all. I may not, if the opera's coming, in other words, if they've hired a European designer who's making it all in Europe, I might not even see sketches. I might have no idea, you know, other than the name of the opera and the characters and the fact that I bought the CD and listened to the music. I might not even really know what time period they're setting it in. Yeah, I might not.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1143.35,1174.1"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e So you meet with the designers, and then you build and fit the costumes sometimes. And then sometimes the costumes come to you already built. And you just do get the accessories and fittings.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1179.26,1194.28"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e and we, yeah, put it all on people. Because honestly, if the costumes come from like Europe or something, they've never been fit on. They've never been fit on the chorus. They're just, and the other thing I do is I send people down to Princeton, I don't know, as soon as they pick the chorus. As soon as it's determined who those 40 people are who are gonna be here, I send maybe four people down on a bus to Princeton with digital cameras and stuff, and they just have like an all day measuring and photographing session. Now if we're making the clothes, then I tap the measurements. If somebody else is making the clothes, I make them copies and give it to them. If somebody in Europe is making the clothes, we translate the measurements into centimeters just to make it easier for them, or I even put it on. I have an Italian measurement sheet and a French measurement. I have different measurement sheets in different languages. and I'll translate the measurements into centimeters and then I'll fax them over to, you know, whatever shop in Europe is making them, just to be, I could send them in inches, but I feel like it's nice, you know, just so that they don't have to make the, somebody's gonna convert it, so it might as well be us.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1194.83,1273.89"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e and so the costumes you make are for the choir and the opera sometimes and then the place...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1275.7,1281.24"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, it's the opera, it's the choir being in the opera, and the principals being in the opera.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1281.25,1287.41"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes. OK, but not some of the plays.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1287.56,1290.28"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e The plays usually comes from somewhere. It's usually, actually my very first year here, the festival produced a play. God, was it in the Garden Theater? They actually produced a play. And it was supposed to be a Pinter play, and then it wasn't. It was.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1290.61,1315.21"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e The American Clock by Arthur Miller?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1316.43,1317.593"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e No. Go back to 1980. Well, they did The American Clock. They did that at the Dock Street.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1318.15,1323.67"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Directions to Service.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1324.11,1324.93"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e No, that was a Japanese thing. Yeah. But I never saw it. I heard it was great. They actually had, like, chickens and mice in it and stuff. They had mice in the costumes. They had tubes running around. The little mice were running around in the tubes. It was called, I want to say it was called The Corridor. How's that? That just flashed into my mind.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1326.175,1347.69"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e The Corridor. That was 1981.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1349.15,1349.57"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh, all right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1350.42,1351.2"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e By Diane Kagan.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1352.18,1352.875"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay. Well, that was my second year then. I think the festival, I believe, produced that play because I had to make a costume for it at the last minute. I mean, really down here. And I was finishing it. We, they called, somebody called me a cab and we, I was sewing snaps onto it in the cab on the way to the theater for opening night. really that was how tight it was and the actress who was wearing it was one of those really delicate southern Tennessee Williams sort of older women who had like smelling salts with her if you could believe it and it was just like fainting every five minutes or having an anxiety attack during the fitting and I'm like I'm thinking honey I gotta make this dress like by tomorrow Can you chill out and she is? Just like, oh, I have the vapors, oh, you know, passing out and stuff, and I'm trying, and like, really, see, she had an assistant with her who actually smacked her, I'm not kidding, was like, Diane, you know, did whatever her name, I forget her name, Diane was the director, but she was like, calm down, she just smacked her, and then she like reached in her pocket and cracked open a smelling salts and put it under her nose, and she sort of came back to life, and I continued fitting, and I thought, oh my god.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1353.008,1436.13"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Wow.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1436.513,1436.513"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e She was such an old-fashioned kind of woman, really. And then I just was like, thank god it was a simple dress. I just saw that dress the other day. It's hanging up in storage. And I was like, I had this memory come flooding back to me. When she left, I just thought, oh my god. I said, I feel like I've just been gang raped or something. Because it was so exhausting. Really. But then we were there, we actually finished the dress in the cab on the way to the theater. in the way of the theater.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1438.069,1472.07"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e My goodness. So in your position, then you get to really get a different side of everything. You get to interact with the singers, the designers, the directors, the actors.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1472.43,1486.721"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Right. We're much more like in the production department. I know you're going to talk to Leslie at like five o 'clock and Leslie and I are the oddballs. I mean, first of all, we're chicks, you know, we're women, and we can, you know, I can dress elegantly because I'm not, you know, gonna come in with steel-toed boots and, you know, tool belts around my waist. And I totally remember there was a guy who now works in New York at the Lincoln Center Festival. He's the TD there. But he was, one year he was the TD here at the Gaillard. He said something, I said something about the performer and he said, oh yeah, you gotta deal with the talent. And that, I thought, yeah, that is the difference. That we know, or I can remember being in a production meeting for Fidelio and the TD of the gag at that time said to the director, who was a Nazi, really, and did not suffer fools. I mean, if you were wrong, if he caught you in an error, it was like the oven door slammed, really.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1486.97,1563.58"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e And so here we are at this production meeting and the TD says, well, what act should I, how should I have the scenery set up for tomorrow's rehearsal? And the director says, well, we will start with Florestan's aria. And he says, well, is that the first act or the second? And I'm like, oh, that's God's first act, and then the first act, you know, and I just, and really, he looked at him with contempt, and he curled his lips, and he said, Florestan is not in the first act. And I heard the oven door, I thought, oh, he just, you're dead to him now. He just thinks you're an idiot, and he's written you off, and he's just, that's it. And, but of course, me and Leslie, we do deal with the art. We're not we're not moving stuff around on stage. We have to be dressed nice. We have to be able we know the opera. I listen to the music. I know what the character's motivation is. I'm not I'm not taking this piece of scenery and moving it from here to here because somebody told me to. I'm saying she needs to wear a red dress because she's whatever or she needs this dress needs to be sad or it needs to be flirtatious or it needs to be you out. Her hair needs to be like this. Her shoes need to be like that because...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1564.66,1645.16"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e So we are dealing with the more human aspect of the productions as opposed to the technical lights on, curtain up, tracking scenery back and forth, you know, moving chairs around. We're dealing with people. And it is, I mean, that's the thing about... Of course, when you make scenery, you make it to fit in the theater. The theater has no opinion. The theater doesn't say, but my hips look fat in this or my shoulders are, you know, what can you do about my chin or, you know, I don't wear this color or whatever. The theater, it just has to, the set has to fit in the theater, but the costumes have to fit on. each person of whom there could be 50 or 100 and each character. I mean, if I was making something for you, I'd have to work with you, who you are as you, but I'd also have to work with who you are playing. And then I'd have to work with all your insecurities about who you are, whatever you felt about your body, and all your insecurities about however you felt about the person you were playing. Like, did you, because a lot of times singers will take out, if a singer is having a bad day vocally, they'll take it out on their clothes. You know, they'll say, oh my vest is too tight, or my, you know, and it's like the vest is no tighter than it was yesterday, you're just having it off. You just couldn't hit the note, and you can't. You can't blame it on yourself, so you're going to blame it on the bossa nova. Basically, you're going to say, oh, my hem is too long, or something.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1646.72,1761.76"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e And so it is, I always, I have a degree in psychology. I never studied this, I never, I don't have any degrees in theater or sewing or costumes or anything. I just have a degree in psychology. And I use it constantly because I'm, even though I didn't want to become a therapist, really, when you're in a fitting with somebody. you really a lot of times have to stroke them, massage them, seduce them even into accepting. You have to, especially with opera singers, dancers love their bodies and they're all, you know, they spend hours a day looking at their, you know, nearly naked perfect forms in the mirror, obsessing over their perfect calves and their fabulous points and all that, you know, their beautiful ankle bones. They just, they can't wait to take off their clothes. Opera singers who are as a group tend to be, you know, a little soft, a little fleshy, a little not, you know, perfect. They actually are quite insecure about their bodies and they are not always comfortable looking in the mirror and they can't always imagine themselves being the young lover or the young girl, even though they have to, and so you have to help them. You know, you kind of have to seduce them in a way, really. You have to get them to see themselves as that person.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1754.86,1858.37"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e How do you do that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1859.44,1860.18"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e I'm good at it. I know I do it. I mean sometimes I just lock eyes with people I You know I I saw I look at their bodies, and I size them up But I don't let them know that I'm looking at their bodies. I always keep looking into their eyes, and I talk to them a lot, and I touch them all I will I'm very much I will very frequently put my hands on the on the shoulders of of a nervous singer and with just some pressure and talk to them in such a way. And many singers have told me that I'm very calming for them backstage. When they see me backstage, they relax.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1860.99,1905.179"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e And one singer, God, in Fanciulla del West, the leading man, he insisted that I walk down the stairs with him and with and I always I had I would be like two steps behind him with my with my left hand just lightly above his shoulder I didn't even make contact with his shoulder but I just was floating above his shoulder like right because here's the banister in the Gaillard right and he'd be walking down and I'd be walking down with my left hand on his right shoulder. And then I would walk him to where he made his entrance. And I would stand in that place until he went on. And until he, and he would look at me, he would just look at me to see that I was there before he sung his first note. And he wanted to know that I was there. And then once he started singing the aria and everything was okay and he didn't faint or die or whatever, then I could go back upstairs and go on with whatever it was. And I have no idea, I mean, I just must have calmed him down. I was like a good luck charm, like a rabbit in a, a rabbit's foot in a pocket or something. And he just wanted me to be there, you know, for whatever reason. So I did it, because it made him calm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1906.52,1997.16"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e So you have altered designs after you may have planned something out in New York and you came down with this costume and they said, \"This color doesn't look good on me.\" Have you ever changed the color?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=1998.18,2010.02"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, no, it's not for the performer to say this. I mean, the performer might say this color doesn't look good on me, but the performer's not going to. I mean, it depends. Honestly, if the performer is stronger than the designer, if the designer doesn't have a great, clear vision, if the designer's a little wishy -washy, the performer could win that argument easily. Now, it also, see, I'm going to put a caveat here. If the show is really designed, like if it's, let's say, an oldie -timey show, in some period where everything because you couldn't go to the store and buy it, so it all had to be made. Then chances are the designer is strong. The designer has drawn everything and thought about every color and and so that there's a vision there. If it's one of these shows where you're just going to go like, oh well we're sort of doing it in some time period and we're just going to go out and buy some stuff and it's sort of contemporary, but sort of no time, blah, blah, whatever it is. Well, okay, then anybody can say, \"Oh I don't like that dress get another one,\" because if if I've made a dress that costs three, four, or five thousand dollars, let's say.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2009.86,2095.81"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/59","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e You're wearing it [laughs].","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2096.51,2097.239"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/60","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e You're wearing it you know it took two months to make you know whatever the fabric was custom dyed it was whatever you're wearing that dress. But if I bought something, if I went out to like odd lots and bought something, and you said, and it's, you know, here's the other thing, if it's some dress, let's say it's a bustle dress or a hoop skirt or whatever, you the performer don't wear that in your life, so you're probably going to put it on. But if it's jeans and a t -shirt, you're going to actually have more opinions about the jeans and the t -shirt. That's actually, for me, a more difficult costume. than it is than the hoop skirt is. Because you are going to have some, it's not going to fit like your jeans. Well, you can't say about the hoop skirt, this doesn't feel like my hoop skirt because you don't have one. Or this corset doesn't feel like my corset because you don't want. But, but if I put you in something that I bought, you know, at, you know, Berlin's or something, you're going to say, well, I don't like this is, you know, and, and because you also know that I can go out and get you another one or a different one, whereas that hoop skirt, I can't, right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2097.39,2166.46"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/61","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e So there's actually going to be, there's actually more farting around on those sort of wishy-washy contemporary shows than there is on real shows, let's say. Yeah, right? I'd much rather do a real show. I mean, every genuine costume designer in New York, they'll all say, Oh, I hate contemporary shows. Because you end up with racks of clothes. You just keep trying stuff on people and trying stuff on it and it keeps changing and changing and everyone has an opinion, you know, the director's wife and the girlfriend and everybody has an opinion about it, whereas if it's designed and it's period and it looks and it has a strong vision that nobody can argue with it, it's got, you've got nothing to say, because it's what it is. You can hate it, but it's what it is, but you can't, you can't. Muck it up. You can't muck around with it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2167.0,2227.42"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/62","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e So what is your interaction then with the director and producers, or designers and the directors? Do you interact with them much?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2228.07,2237.49"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/63","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e I'm not so I mean again. I might be at a production meeting. It depends. It depends on the director honestly some directors especially some there are some European directors who are like those Empresario types who you know direct design the costumes design the set design right there like let's say I think you know they're talking about you know maybe John Pascoe coming back next year You know he did Platée and he you know I think he was everything except for the lighting designer. I mean, he designed the props, the costumes, the sets. He directed it, you know. So I had tons of interaction with him. Not necessarily as a director, but he happened to be the director. And sometimes it just depends on the director. I mean, there are certain directors who've been here for several years, and they really like me. And so maybe they go out of their way to interact with me or to include me or something, because they trust me as a colleague and they want my input in stuff. But then there are directors who I'll just see in passing. I mean, it's mostly the costume designer who's really gonna. interact with the director.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2238.08,2321.5"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/64","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e And you just execute the costume designer's wishes, at the end.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2325.17,2327.07"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/65","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, yes, that is pretty much what I'm trying to do.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2327.91,2331.71"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/66","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e That's a lot, and then you're therapist, as well. [laughs].","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2332.46,2334.752"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/67","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, that's just the, I mean that just makes the, it's just part of the job because you're dealing with people and it's, and if you can deal with people in a successful way, and it is, you're manipulating them really for your own purposes, but it just makes it easier. You know, if they think they're happy, you know, if you, if you can... you know, trick them into being happy, it's just easier for you, really. And I'm all for making it as easy for me as possible.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2335.18,2365.73"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/68","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e So you have a location on Elizabeth Street? What's the history of that being your base of operation?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2370.5,2380.66"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/69","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, the first couple of years, we were in Footlights players. which is down, so I think it's Pennsylvania Alley or Philadelphia Alley or something. It's attached to the Footlights Theatre. It's funny about costume shops. I mean, it was very small, but it was already a costume shop. It was their costume shop, the local theater company's costume shop. So we would just, they would sort of vacate the premises, and we would come in for, you know, six weeks, and we'd use all their stuff. And then when we left, so it was okay because they were like entities sharing a space. I'll get to this in a minute. And we, there were doors so we could go outside in the alley and spray paint and dye and stuff because one of the other things we do is distress costumes to make them look old, you know. Just, you know, spray them with toxic chemicals and so they, but that's why you got to, you either have to be in a well-ventilated space or you have to go outside. You know, then after a couple of years, I guess that like Piccolo Spoleto started to you know, be something. And so that these little theater companies that use Footlights Players didn't want to just close while the festival was here. They actually wanted to have a season while the festival was here so they could capitalize on the increased audience in town. So we couldn't use their space anymore. So they moved us to the old city jail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2381.25,2484.74"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/70","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Really?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2487.54,2487.54"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/71","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Right, and see, this is where, now see, these things like this make me crazy because for me to do what I do, I gotta know where I'm being. I gotta know that my space is, that I can work in my space, that my stuff is there, that it's, you know, that it's all okay. I gotta have a home and I didn't. You know, we flew down that year not knowing where the day that I landed they took me to see the Old City Jail. And there was nothing set up. I mean it was still set up as the Old City Jail. I mean it had been used as a museum for the jail. So there were like, I took the stationary and stuff there, but the first thing when we walked in was there was a dead body, a dummy, a guy in a tuxedo shirt with a bloody...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2487.71,2547.89"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/72","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh stop [laughs].","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2548.51,2548.993"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/73","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e ...bullet hole in his chest, and the most ghastly expression on space lying on the floor. And here we walk into this dank, dark building that...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2548.993,2556.07"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/74","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Is creepy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2557.539,2557.698"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/75","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e It's creepy and totally haunted, really. And we turn the corner and there he is. And I just shriek at the top of my lungs, really. I thought I was going to have a heart attack. And that just, you know, and so.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2557.23,2576.27"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/76","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e So they hadn't even cleared it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2576.86,2577.96"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/77","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e No, nothing, no. And everything, like the museum counters were in there. So we, so the first week, and remember, we only have maybe three weeks, you know, not even quite three weeks, like, to get ready for dress rehearsal. The first, and we're doing two operas. And I think that year we were doing them, like they were, I'm not even, I don't even think they were coming from Italy. I think they originated with us. So the first week we are making the space with special projects, this group of carpenters and electricians and stuff. We are in there like night and day ripping out museum counters and putting in tables and whatever. And I am like, you're kidding me, right? Really? I mean, because I don't have a lot of time here. And It was exhausting, but it also felt good to be finished. And we didn't have to share that. There was tons of room. That was the other thing. So any kind of stock we had accumulated, I mean, it was massive amounts of space. And, you know, the walls were like two feet thick and, you know, there was tons of wonderful air circulation. I mean, really, and there were rooms where I could put the various, the clothes that we weren't working on. Let's say all the, maybe this 10 racks of clothes in this opera and 12 racks of clothes in that opera. I could keep those in that room and those in that room and I could only take out the things that we were fitting and the things that we were working on. And it was really, in a way, ideal space with a couple of issues.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2577.92,2695.41"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/78","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e One was that there were cracks in the walls that went right through, and so any kind of weather - whatever was outside was inside. The other thing that was, I think, for me, that because the festival didn't own the space, and they rented it for a dollar a year from the city, they didn't do things to it. Like, like the plumbing in the shop came up, there was a garden hose and they put a hole in the floor and whatever. The kind of, everything was sort of a band -aid solution, which I can't, I don't know. When you only do something six weeks a year, Why should you have a permanent? But of course, I'm doing something six weeks a year for 30 years or 29. So for me, it is permanent. I do want it to be permanent.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2696.35,2752.26"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/79","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, I want to see it get better every year. I want to make some kind of improvement every year. I don't want to say, you know, it's a garden. Hey, listen, it's a garden hose. We need water. It gets water up. I mean, OK, who cares? Really, I want. somebody to say, well last year we had a garden hose, but this year we're having plumbing. See, and that, so that's my agenda, let's say. And that was never happening there. And also, because the city owned it, they had some big Halloween party in there every year for like, you know, people south of Broad and rich Charlestonians. And, you know, they'd come in and, oh, say that's a great hat and, you know, whatever, they'd sort of borrow things and move things. And that also made me a little crazy, but it was great space. I mean, it was great space. And it was totally haunted. I mean, it was completely haunted. I mean, I laugh sometimes because they do those ghost tours, and I just think those people are just telling tales that they've read. I have ghost stories that I experienced myself personally in that place, that they...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2753.08,2835.08"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/80","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e What kind of story?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2837.83,2838.97"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/81","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, like when we were doing Mary Widow, I was working in there late, because I regularly worked around the clock, you know, that week when we were getting ready. I mean, it would be nothing to work maybe six or seven days at a clip with an hour of sleep, if even, you know, or I'd race home and take a shower, like once I started to smell myself or I'd home and change my underwear, really. You know, that happened routinely. And this one, I was there, this was a year, I brought my cat down and the workshop room, which was a big, like a 3,000 square foot room, and it had this massive bar door. It was a jail door. It had a little tray to put food through and everything like that, you know, like that. And really, I don't weigh that much. I mean, every morning when I came in, I'd unlock the door and I would heave my entire body against it to get it to open up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2839.33,2908.39"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/82","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e So there we are, and maybe it's, I don't know, it's four o 'clock in the morning on a still night. Because my cat was in the shop, we had woven, we were keeping the door closed when we were in there, and we had woven a piece of cardboard through the bars at the bottom of the door so he couldn't get out the door. And there we are, it's four o 'clock in the morning or something, and we're working away, and all of a sudden, the lights went off and the door opened. Now on the I mean, even in gale force hurricane winds, it's a bar door. The wind would blow through the bars, really. I mean, and it was not a windy night, I can tell you. But the door just opened, the lights went out, and the cat went out the room. out and the cat went out the room. You know, and we just were shrieking and hugging each other. I mean, really, we were like, ah! And, you know, once our hysteria died down a moment, we grabbed a flashlight and we sort of tiptoed our way to the fuse box and the fuses were fine. And at that moment, the lights came on and we were just, and we found the cat and put him back and we went home.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2911.15,2983.23"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/83","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Basically, I mean, we just went home. We locked up and went home. We were terrified, and I said, well, that's it. I never, you know, and then another night, I was in there by myself. You wonder, like, I must be crazy, right? And I was in, I had sent everybody home, and I was in there by myself working. I was sitting in, I was sewing something, and they didn't have 24-hour radio stations, right? So. So the radio station I was listening to, they'd say, well, we're signing off for the night. You know, they'd turn off. I'd turn on to another radio station. And then an hour later, they'd go, oh, we're signing off for the night. And it got to the point where there were no radio stations left. And I was just, it was just me and the place. The radio was turned off and I just heard such, my head filled up with such rumblings. That's all I can say. I just hear noise and clattering and talking and [imitates noises] just [imitates noises] and I ran out of the building screaming. I left all the lights on, the door wide open, the iron on. I left everything as it was. I did not take any time to look back or lock anything. I grabbed my bike. and I pedaled home, and I never was in that place alone again. I said, I will not work here. If I'm going to work till four in the morning, somebody else has to work till four in the morning with me. I'm not doing this alone, really. I was that daring. And I don't believe in ghosts, but I do. After that, I do. I was always very like, oh, please, you know. I'm a very non-mystical person. But that... I believe in ghosts. I mean, now I do because I was there and that, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2983.7,3090.38"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/84","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Clattering like a jail rattle?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3090.96,3092.78"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/85","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Just everything, the noise of however many hundreds of angry, starving, whatever people were in there, just clattering, shattering, clattering noise, chains, you name it, just like [imitates noise] that's what it was, it filled my head, I can still hear It was [imitates noise]. And I just went, ah, and I ran out of the place. And I really, I didn't, if anybody wanted to rob the place, that would have been the night, because it was wide open, lights on, whatever. You know, I didn't care. I didn't care if the iron caught fire. I just had to get out, really. I got out. And that was it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3092.66,3135.294"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/86","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e How did you get from there to Elizabeth Street?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3137.36,3139.096"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/87","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, then the city started to make noise about throwing us out, because then they wanted that. You know, the truth is, you know, when you're a charity, you know, they give you the least valuable piece of real estate, and then when that, you know, then when they decide they want it, because whatever, because real estate gets more valuable, or that neighborhood gets hot, or whatever, they toss you out of that. And there was a lot of talk about the fact that it was unsafe, that it was starting to be structurally unsound, that the cracks were getting bigger and there were areas where we couldn't go into because the floor was, you know, whatever.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3140.01,3179.26"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/88","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e So I started, I had bought my first house by then and I started looking with my real estate agent, Terry Seabrook, for a place that we could call our own that we wouldn't have to share that we wouldn't have to have Halloween costumes and whatever that that wasn't haunted you know whatever that that we could use and we looked at many places and the festival's position was I guess, \"Well the city hasn't thrown us out yet.\" And I was like my position was like, \"Yeah, but they're gonna and when they do we have be prepared.\" And so many people suggested many things like, well, we'll build you a loft at the scene shop. OK, that's very nice. There's a reason that when furniture companies, they don't do the upholstery in the same building as the woodworking. I mean, it's not, you know, you're not, now what are we going to bus all the singers out to the warehouse? I mean, how are we going to get there on our bikes? It's going to be dirty. You know, they're not going to vent it properly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3180.38,3260.52"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/89","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e And P.S., I come here for the charm and the delight of the city, I'm not going out to some, I'm not going to North Charleston and being in a warehouse all day, I've got to tell you. And that's fine, that's my personal thing, I can just stop coming, I don't really care, but I'm not going to leave my shop in New York to come down here to be in a warehouse. That's the end of that, that's the deal breaker.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3262.26,3289.88"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/90","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e So after much hemming and hawing and finding places that were actually could have been terrific. Then it became really inevitable. Oh, but somebody said, here's another thing. Somebody said, \"Oh, we found this great space. You'll love it! It's carpeted.\" Okay. Carpeting is the worst thing in the world. You can have it at a costume shop. Every pin that you drop on that table becomes, gets embedded in the carpet. You know, and then you can't walk barefoot, I mean, whatever, which I like to wear barefoot, but I could wear shoes, but it doesn't matter. There's pins sticking up everywhere. I mean, a lot of times I have to get down on my hands and knees to do a hem, and I don't want to be impaled. It's the worst, and then you have to vacuum the floor to get the fabric, it's the worst. Carpeting is the worst thing in the world and that and the fact that people's make these suggestions means that they don't understand what it is you do and they shouldn't be looking for the space for you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3291.99,3360.47"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/91","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e That's the reality because, just like you shouldn't be looking for their space either, because you don't know what they do. So so when people come at you with these suggestions, and you just go oh, and then they get insulted because you're not listening to their idea, but you're like, I don't care about your - your idea is based on nothing, so keep it to yourself because it's a bad idea. You know why suggest a bad idea?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3360.81,3385.3"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/92","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Anyway, so we found this wonderful - and it's still there - on Cannon Street, actually, on Cannon and Smith, right? I could see it from my house that I bought. And it was a like a five thousand square foot auto repair shop. It was this big garage workshop. And there was a single house in front of it, a wrecked, you know, single house. And, and it had a paint sprayer booth with, so you knew it was vented for, right, with a big fan system so you could spray your costumes in there. And it even had like a, I think it was a '57 Chevy convertible that just, an old, that came.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3385.72,3428.54"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/93","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Came with it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3428.92,3429.092"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/94","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Some classic, yeah. And my feeling was, hell, just get the, you're just buying the garage. The house is like free. Cars, whatever, you know, that's a bonus. But, you know, eventually, yeah, sure, when you have the money, you'll restore the house and then you can house the wardrobe people there or you could house some singers. You could do whatever, I mean, whatever. You could do whatever you wanted. It's a house, for God's sake. But, you know, meanwhile, you've got this huge amount of space that, you know, one story, one big room that you can, without too much horror and work make into a, that's my cell phone going off, that you could make into a classroom show. So, but no, they weren't ready. The city hadn't quite thrown us out yet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3430.019,3480.11"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/95","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e So, of course, and then when we were ready, the place wasn't available, and what was available was Elizabeth Street, which is about the same price for half the space. And, and Elizabeth Street has its problems. One of which is that the stock, all the clothes we've amassed over the years, doesn't fit there, so that's stored in the Gaillard. So it's not terribly far away, but it's far enough away to be out of sight, out of mind, really. The other problem with it is that it's one big room. And so there is no separate space to put this opera's costumes and that opera's costumes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3480.67,3524.56"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/96","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e So they're all, they're in there the whole time. And we've adapted to it and it's fine. I find that when the operas were stored in separate rooms, people understood that they were separate operas. I find nowadays, I, somebody says, \"Well, what opera is this in?\" And I say, \"What does it look like? You see how all those clothes on the first five racks sort of the same, and then those clothes look sort of different. What do you think it looks like? Use your brain!\" But in fact, most people don't. Most people don't think to the level that I think, and so they just want me to tell them what rack to put it on. You know, I want them to figure it out, and it was easier to get them to figure out, to figure it out when they were in separate rooms. They're not, and that's fine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3524.8,3575.08"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/97","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e The great things about it are that it's in a sort of a very easy to get to, but not too heavily trafficked part of town. So we can park our car there, we can park our bikes there. Because it is all in one room, I am like the central heartbeat of it. In other words, if I'm in the fitting room and the phone rings, I can hear whoever answers the phone. I can hear their half of the conversation and I can shout over the wall, \"Oh, tell them that,\" blah, blah, blah, whatever. Or if I can hear if a sewing machine starts some muck up out there in the workroom. I can hear if somebody's doing something wrong. And I can just, you know, I could be doing a fitting and I could say, \"Excuse me,\" and I could stick my head out of the curtain and say, \"You need oil on your machine,\" or \"Change your needle for God's sake. Don't you hear that? You're, you know, you're impaling the fabric. You know, I can hear it from in here. Why can't you hear it?\".","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3577.31,3644.84"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/98","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e But again, I think more sensitively than the people I tend to, that I get, you know. I wish everybody was like me, but they're not. And that's how it is. Really, I'm serious. My idea of heaven is the world populated with me. That sounds ridiculous. It's totally true, I believe it. So, I can control, hear, listen to, know everything that's going on in that shop all the time, even if I'm doing something else. And that is a good thing, you know, because it means that I can avoid a lot of mistakes. Um.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3645.36,3690.12"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/99","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e What year were you at the Elizabeth Street house?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3691.0,3693.705"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I guess I've been there for 19 years, and the other thing about it is that since the festival owns it, or owned it, whatever, they actually took care of it in a way that they never invested in the jail. That, you know, that they leveled the floor and painted it and fixed the roof when it leaked and put air conditioners in it and stuff that, you know, I don't think that would have happened in a space that they were paying a buck a year for. Because, you don't respect the space that you...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3694.1,3732.149"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Do you leave your stuff in there over the year?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3732.71,3734.59"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes, and that is the best part of it is that I don't have to worry about, you know, spending a week moving in and out every year and with the attendant breakages, loss, you know, where is that again? Where did we put that? You know, and everything can be just where I left it, which is very, that is the single most important thing to me. And so the fact that we lost the acres of space we had at the jail was compensated for by the fact that we could just turn the key and walk away from it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3734.67,3780.92"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Control and continuity.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3782.9,3783.238"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3783.285,3783.332"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e So why have you remained devoted to the festival? Why have you kept coming back?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3784.17,3789.83"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/106","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e No, and I maybe I said that in the, I'm I think that I'm my devotion is with is to the town. That's my devotion. The festival is you know, maybe I'm using the festival or something. I mean I'm I have years where I'm very devoted to the festival and years where I'm less devoted to the festival and it depends. Sometimes, I mean, sometimes we have great exciting years where the program is spectacular, and sometimes we have lackluster years where the program is not so great. Sometimes we have years where, for me and my shop in New York, we're doing an amazing, like the year we did Le Comte Ory, an amazing, for us, artistic, thrilling, wonderful clothes to make.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3790.04,3843.27"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e And sometimes it's just boring. And sometimes, sometimes there's not even enough work for us, like this year, frankly, there was not really enough for my shop to do to make it worth it financially for me to come down. My accountant has been begging me for years to stop doing this because it really does hurt my business at a certain point. Like the you know - But honestly, this year the economy is so bad in general that it's not like we had that much work to do in New York anyway. So I just, you know, I might as well come here, even though it's not, for me and my shop, such an artistic, at least thrilling year.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3843.69,3892.1"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e So how does working at Spoleto compare with working on Broadway shows?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3893.64,3898.28"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh, it's completely different. I mean, it's just completely, it's completely different. When I work on a Broadway show, I rarely go to the theater. We just make, we make stuff, you know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3899.2,3910.12"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e That's the production end of it, rather than the fitting side?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3910.78,3910.78"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, I mean, sure, the actress, actor will come in for a fitting, but I won't sit through dress rehearsals and stuff like that. I won't be at the tech table with the director or anything. I mean, I won't go to production meetings or anything, you know, except for the fact that we're making, you know, clothes that are period. We could be just making clothes, you know, but here it's more of a total immersion thing. And I do this as a break from, I mean, by the time May rolls around, I pretty much want to kill everyone on my staff, these people have worked with me for 20 or more years and I love them all, but, you know, I just, they probably want to kill me too. They're just like, could you send her to Charleston?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3912.31,3962.02"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Now, some of them panic when I leave town. They're like, oh my god, she's leaving, what will we do? And they call me all the time and I get on the phone and I be their mother and I reassure them. But I mean, I pretty much need to, just for my own head. And it's funny, because remember in the movie Titanic, and Leonardo DiCaprio says to Kate Winslet at a certain point, she gets all insulted at something he says to her. And he says, \"I'm sorry, you just look like an indoor kind of girl to me.\" Such a un-1912 line, but I love it. But in New York, I'm an indoor girl. I mean, I mostly, I get up, I get on the subway, I go to my shop and I stay there all day and then maybe it gets to be 10 or 11 o 'clock at night and I get on the subway in the opposite direction and I go home. Here, I have a bike, I get a tan, you know, I eat lunch on the step outside, I could still hear the phone ring if I have to run in and get the phone, you know, I'm just around, there's flowers everywhere, there's Confederate Jasmine in the air, you know, you can see the water, not, you know, you just have to travel a couple blocks and you can actually see water, you know, off the edge there. And I'm very much an outdoor girl here, you know. And that little six weeks of being an outdoor girl is critically important to me, which is why, you know, \"Hey, we'll move the costume shop to the warehouse in North Charleston.\" - not happening.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=3962.4,4069.57"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Again, it can happen, but then my motivation to be here ceases to exist. I can come down for a vacation. I can come down, look at my four houses. I can come down. I can decide I'm ready to retire and I'm gonna live in one of those four houses, but I'm not doing, you know, I'm not, if I have to work exactly the way I have to work in New York here, then I'm gonna stay in New York, because that's where I am. And that's where it behooves me to stay. I come down here for something different. And so if you ask what fuels my devotion, I guess it's that it takes me out of my life without... I'm still doing costumes. I'm not a person who just takes vacations. I don't go somewhere for no reason and do nothing except be a tourist. Well, I've I must never have done that in my life. This is my, I consider this my vacation, in a wacky sort of sick, screwed up...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4070.81,4140.39"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Sleeping one hour a night kind of way...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4142.819,4142.836"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Right, exactly. Yeah, but once the festival opens, you see, for wardrobe, it gets like those stagehands will be up all night changing the scenery around and whatever, but wardrobe will get, they'll get the break then. They won't, once the festival opens, it won't be as terrible as the first three weeks. So there will be some compensation. There'll be a reward.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4143.94,4165.86"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Mm -hmm. Now, I guess you get a budget every year that you have to operate around, or is it for a certain opera? They tell you this is how much money you have because how do you...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4166.64,4180.48"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e The crew gets a budget. I mean, I get a budget for my crew, which I may or may not stick to, depending on how realistic it is. I mean, I have to see what the program looks like and what the needs of each of the various companies are. And then, yes, the opera that we're making, either once I see the clothes, I budget them. Um, or somebody else, but you know, this, like this year, because they were mostly going to be purchased, something I'm not good at budgeting at all because I don't do it, you know. During the year, I never, I just, we make everything we do, we make. And if we alter bought clothes, it's because someone else has bought them and brought them to us to alter them. And so I have an hourly rate I charge to alter them, but I have no idea how much they cost or how much it costs to get them. Because even if the dress cost $100, I mean, somebody may have spent a week looking for it and that person got paid, you know, and that person took a lot of subways or cabs or went to 30 different stores or whatever. So, that dress costs way more than the $100 that they pay for it. But I don't really, that's not my, because I don't do that all year. I don't know what...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4179.33,4271.8"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e But in terms of your... when it comes to you, you have everything you need, or is there a consideration that you have to make, sometimes there's an alteration which might involve a certain fabric which would be more expensive, and you just don't have... do you have to make those kinds of considerations?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4273.79,4293.37"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, there's always going to be, you're going to take your best guess and then the reality, it's going to cost what it costs, ultimately. I mean, you don't know. I don't know, the second time we did Ariadne auf Naxos, I don't know why we did, because the first production we did was the be-all and end-all, as far as I'm concerned. I hope they never would have done that again in my lifetime, but they did. Anyway, this production came over from France, and they made things. I sent the measurements, and so the production was complete. So... And yes, obviously, there were never any fittings, so we were gonna fit things on people and alter them. And that's not gonna cost any more money because we're doing it, the people in Charleston are on the payroll, and so whatever they do, it's covered.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4293.38,4345.57"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/120","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e But here's a perfect example. Ariadne is a very small show. I unpacked it myself. I hung everything up and I looked at it all and said, ugh, this is lackluster, whatever. But it's fine. It's very amateurly made. You know, it's not, it's not a good shop that they used in France. And I'd seen their stuff before, and it's sad, but it's fine. Anyway, I'm sitting at my desk one day, and I had scheduled some fittings. And I look out the door, some choir girls were coming. And Ariadne is a small opera, so, you know, it's... If you have an opera with a big chorus, if you don't fit in this dress, maybe you'll fit in that dress, whatever. But in Ariadne, that's your dress. You're playing Echo. You have to wear that so there's no, you know, it has to fit you. There's not another choice.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4346.93,4401.82"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/121","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay, so I see coming up the steps an Amazon basically somebody who's actually she was six two or six four or something a massive woman and I think, \"Boy, I hope she's not in Ariadne, because I just hung up all those clothes and there was nothing that size, really. I hope she's just come with some, with those other smaller girls as a friend.\" Well, no, she is one of the girls. And the suit that has her name in it, I, first, we don't even, I, I say, \"Well, I'm sure I'm sending you away and but just put your arm in the sleeve and let's see where we get.\" Well, we get up to her elbow and that's the end of it. I said, okay, let me just, I had, we had measured her. I mean, I had her measurements. I had sent them to France, translated into centimeters. I said, \"Well, you know, you can just go because I'm not gonna try this, right? I'm not gonna humiliate you by trying this.\".","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4402.72,4464.91"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/122","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e So after she left and then I fit the other two girls and they were okay. They needed little alterations, but they were fine. I tried the suit on, and the waist was snug. Once we got the skirt on, the skirt was, I was painted into it basically. And the jacket, the arm holes were so tight that they were cutting off the circulation in my arms. Now this girl, now I'm five, one and three quarters, and I weigh 112 pounds, okay. This girl. was 6' 4\" and weighed 200-something. I mean, she was not a fat girl, but she was a football player, right? The only measurement we had in common was that her waist and my, wait, I think her thigh was the size of my waist or something like that. Or it was something retarded that we had one measurement in common. my waist was the size of her thigh, something, right. It was just ridiculous that I could not fit into a suit. And so, but what could I do? I called my shop and said, in New York, because we can't make anything like this down here, A, we're not gonna find fabric, we're not gonna, we don't have, I don't have the time or the skill, I don't have a tailor, I don't have, you know, we can do alterations, we're not making this garment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4465.31,4554.64"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/123","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e I just called my shop in New York and said, \"Hey, I'm FedExing you this suit. Hello! Make me, put it on a Xerox machine and make one four sizes bigger,\" really. That's what it amounted to, you know. Just find, get some, it's some gray fabric and some nice gray wool. You'll see it tomorrow. I'm faxing them up to the measurements so you can, I did them a little sketch of what the suit looked like so they could start working on it. They had a week to make it, you know. The same thing happened with the leading lady. She came in, actually she was living right around the corner from me, and she had three costumes. So she came in and said one morning, she said, \"Oh I'm right around the corner, can I have a fitting?\" Her fitting was at noon, and I said, \"Oh no, you have to, the designer's not here,\" whatever. So she said, \"Fine, I'll come back at noon.\" She left.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4555.2,4609.54"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I, like, just, again, I was talking to her. I was very calm. I said, \"Oh, come back at noon.\" She left. When she, as soon as she was out of my sight, I grabbed a tape measure. I said, \"Oh, my God, we're in trouble!\" Because visually, I could tell I had hung up those clothes. I knew that those clothes were not going to get on her body. I mean, you know. And I just had those clothes out on the table to tape measure. And I was like, \"Oh my God, oh my God, what are we going to do? We're in trouble!\" I'm going to prepare the shop for the worst, right? I call my shop in New York and I said, \"I'm not going to have the fitting until noon, but I'm going to tell you, I'm pretty, I'm 99.9% sure that you're going to have to make these clothes,\" right? And she came in at noon, and in fact, yes, we couldn't get anything on her.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4610.02,4663.57"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Now the designer at a certain point said, \"Well maybe we should go to Granny's Goodies and see what we can find here so that the festival doesn't have to spend any more money.\" I'm like... \"What? Granny? These are sets of clothes. These are, you've designed these. This is like 1940s Christian Dior new look. Really, you think that Granny's Goodies is gonna have a 1940s Christian Dior new look suit in gray wool for a 6 '4 woman? I don't think they are. And I'm not gonna waste the time to look. When I have people, I need this thing in a week.\".","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4664.47,4703.4"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Then somebody said, \"Well, maybe we should have the shop in France make them since they screwed up.\" I was like, \"Okay, we can do that. And it'll take, what if it gets stuck in customs?\" And I was, they already, they had these measurements. This is what they made. This was the best they could do. Are we gonna give another opportunity to screw up? You know? I have a week, I need these clothes on stage. I'm gonna go to the people who I know can do it. I'm gonna go to the people who I own, really. These people work for me. I'm gonna say to them, \"Drop everything, make this! Stay up all night. I'm the boss of you.\" I can talk to them in English. How do I call the shop in France? They're in a different time zone. I have to get up at four in the morning and call them and then, I have to like try to speak French. They have to try to speak, how is that going to happen? And then what happens when the thing is late and when it's still wrong? Then it's opening night and I am hosed.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4703.74,4765.27"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e I have a problem and I have to solve it in the best way I can and that way is going to be costly. And you didn't budget for it because you think you bought this show and it's complete and that's too bad. However, if you don't want to cancel your opening night, and probably the rest of your run, this is...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4767.89,4790.64"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e Your option.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4793.03,4793.03"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e That's it. This is how I'm solving the problem. If somebody else wants to solve the problem another way, they can take over the department. I'll go home because I don't want to be here. I don't want to see what happens when, you know, don't call me when it doesn't work, in other words. Because I'm telling you, I've been around the block and I know it's not gonna work and I'm not taking that chance with an audience, and an opening, and a bunch of performers. I'm not having the leading lady be nervous that her clothes aren't in town yet, you know. It's not happening. So that's the way I decided to solve it, and it was very expensive. It was expensive, but...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4793.32,4834.23"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/130","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e That's what you have to do.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4838.31,4838.83"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/131","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e What am I going to do? It's life, it's theater, you know, you got to be flexible.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4839.51,4844.21"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/132","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e That's crazy. Crazy stories, my goodness.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4848.43,4849.81"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/133","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e I tell you, I can talk a lot.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4850.61,4851.87"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJessica Lancia:\u003c/strong\u003e I know well, it's three thiry six, see I don't know what your schedule is. I've got an interview at four. And I can stay on until then if you have the time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4852.11,4862.83"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh, all right. Oh, let me just see, somebody... I heard my phone ring. I keep it very quiet. Oh, four missed calls. Let's see who called me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4863.03,4874.19"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/136","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eCarolyn Kostolpoulos:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh, all right. Oh, let me just see, somebody... I heard my phone ring. I keep it very quiet. Oh, four missed calls. Let's see who called me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=4863.03,4874.19"}]},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["English [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/transcript/76845/annotation/137","type":"Annotation","motivation":"subtitling","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/076/845/original/open-uri20250909-81588-vc9hcb.vtt?1757447278","format":"text/vtt","language":"en"},"target":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/076/845/original/open-uri20250909-81588-vc9hcb.vtt?1757447278"}]},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/index/49328","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["First Opera [Index]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/index/49328/annotation/138","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"First Opera","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Title"]}}],"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=479.0,4878.888"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/index/49328/annotation/139","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Carolyn Kostopoulos discusses the first opera she dressed.","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Synopsis"]}}],"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=479.0,4878.888"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/index/49328/annotation/140","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cbr\u003e \u003cbr\u003eJL:  Okay.  Which one was your first opera? \u003cbr\u003e \u003cbr\u003eCK:  Well, I dressed Transformations and Chip and His Dog . \u003cbr\u003e \u003cbr\u003eJL:  That was 1980. \u003cbr\u003e \u003cbr\u003eCK:  Yeah, so that’s my first year. \u003cbr\u003e \u003cbr\u003eJL:  The first opera, yep. \u003cbr\u003e \u003cbr\u003eCK:  And we were also doing Sonnambula, in the Gaillad. \u003cbr\u003e \u003cbr\u003eJL: Yes, Sonnambula, Chip and His Dog — \u003cbr\u003e \u003cbr\u003eCK:  That was all the same year, right.  And I didn’t dress Sonnambula, although I made a costume for it, which is still hanging in the cage with fabric that I bought at Anson Fabrics, which is now a condominium on Anson Street.","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Partial Transcript"]}}],"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=479.0,4878.888"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/index/49328/annotation/141","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"opera","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"transformations","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"chip and his dog","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Sonnambula","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Gaillard","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}}],"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=479.0,4878.888"}]},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/index/49329","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["Ghost Stories from the Old City Jail [Index]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/index/49329/annotation/142","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Ghost Stories from the Old City Jail","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Title"]}}],"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2808.0,4878.888"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/index/49329/annotation/143","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Carolyn Kostopoulos discusses her encounter with the supernatural while working for Spoleto in the Old City Jail.","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Synopsis"]}}],"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2808.0,4878.888"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/index/49329/annotation/144","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":" \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eCK: But it was great space, great space.  And it was totally haunted.  It was completely haunted.  I mean, I laugh sometimes because they give those ghost  tours, and I just think, “Those people are just telling tales that they’ve read, I have ghost stories that I experienced myself, personally, in that place.” \u003cbr\u003e \u003cbr\u003eJL:  Like what kind of stories? \u003cbr\u003e \u003cbr\u003eCK:  Well, when we were doing Merry Widow, I was working in there late, because I regularly worked around the clock that week when we were getting ready.  It would be nothing to work maybe six or seven days at a clip with an hour of sleep, if even.  Or I’d race home and take a shower, like once I started to smell myself, or I’d go home and change my underwear, really.  But that happened routinely.  And this was the year I had brought my cat down, and the workshop room was just a big, 3,000 square foot room, and it had this massive bar door.  It was a jail door ; it had a little tray to put food through and everything.  And really, I don’ t weigh that much; every morning when I came in I’d unlock the door and I would heave my entire bod y against it to get it to open up.  So there we are, and maybe it’s 4:00 in the morning on a  still night, and because my cat was in the shop, we were keeping the door closed when we  were in there, and we had woven a piece of cardboard through the bars at the bottom of the door, so he  couldn’t get out the door.  And there we are, it’s 4:00 in the morning or  something and we’re working away, and all of a sudden the lights went off and the door opened.  Now, even in gale-force hurricane winds, it’s a barred door, the  wind would blow through the bars, really, and it was not a windy night, I can tell you.  But the door just  opened, the lights went out, and the cat went out the room.  And we just were shrieking and hugging each other, really. We were like “Ahh!”  [laughs] And once our hysteria died down a moment, we grabbed a flashlight and tip-toed our way to the fuse box.   The fuses were fine, and at that moment the lights came on, and we found the cat, put him back, and we just went home.  We locked up and went home, we were terrified.   And another night I was in there by myself.  You wonder, I must be crazy, right?  I had  sent everybody home, and I was in there by myself working, and I was sewing something, and they didn’t have 24-hour radio stations.  So the radio station I was listening to, they’d  say, “Well, we’re signing off for the night,” and I’d turn it to another radio station, and then an hour later they’d go, “Oh, we’re signing off for the night.”  It got to the point where there were no radio stations left, and it was just me and the place.  And the radio was turned off, and I just heard \u003cbr\u003esuch—my head filled up with such rumblings.  That’s all I can say.  I could just hear noise, and clattering, and talking, like [imitate s noises], and I ran out of the building screaming.  I left all the light s on, the door wide open, the iron  on.  I left everything as it was.  I did not take any time to look back  or lock anything.  I grabbed my bike, and I pedaled home, and I never was in that place  alone again.  I said if I am going to work until four in the morning, somebody else has to  work until four in the morning with me.  I’m not doing this alone.  And I don’t believe in  ghosts, but after that I do.  I was always like, “Oh, please.”  I am very non-mystical  person.  But now I do, because I was there. \u003cbr\u003e \u003cbr\u003eJL: Clattering, just like a jail rattles? \u003cbr\u003e \u003cbr\u003eCK:  Everything.  The noise of however  many hundreds of angry, starving, whatever, people were in there.  Just clattering, chattering, noise, chains,  you name it.  It just filled my head.  I can still hear it [imitates noises].  And I just when, “Ahh!” and I ran out of the place.  ","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Partial Transcript"]}}],"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2808.0,4878.888"},{"id":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185/index/49329/annotation/145","type":"Annotation","motivation":"supplementing","body":[{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Old City Jail","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Merry WIdow","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Ghosts","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}},{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Hauntings","format":"text/plain","label":{"en":["Keywords"]}}],"target":"https://lcdl.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1695/collection_resources/53010/file/125185#t=2808.0,4878.888"}]}]}]}